I am just a missile. With both the 55 grn M193 and the 62 grn SS109? Any suggestions? ref: my request for help saving target as desktop file, Using this value, it is simple to calculate that the MPBR for a 180 grain Remington Core-Lokt .308 roundnose soft point cartridge in my trusty Remington 700 is 293 yards, with our second zero at 252 yards. I know this is hard for some of you to understand but trust me, this is what I was born to do. I’ve saved off as a .jpeg, .png, .pdf, .bitmap and none seem to scale work appropriately. setTimeout( At a minimum he won’t procreate the race anymore and this planet will indeed be a better place. The illustration is confusing (and pretty lame, to be that confusing – I blame the art department.). A very informative article, but the comments are just downright entertaining. Click to share on Facebook (Opens in new window), Click to share on Twitter (Opens in new window), Click to share on Pinterest (Opens in new window). Now I am sure they teach this in boot frank so maybe you should go back and re learn it, and hey while your there go ahead and pick up some common sense, and then defiinantly study up on your Corps values and learn to embrace them. Thanks Shawn. My own experience is that at a 25 yard zero, it drops about an inch at 50 but 9 inches at 100 yards. Meters : The meter (symbol m) is the fundamental unit of length in the International System of Units (SI). So without swearing I have agreed with Frank to explain how some people just don’t get the point with politeness because they make their half-assed opinions their religion. What Zero do you use? if ( notice ) It actually DOES cause the bullet to rise (though in my opinion at the cost of increasing spin drift, just a personal observation). Required fields are marked *, (function( timeout ) { The sites will angle the rifle upwards because of gravity pulling the round down. At the beginning some anglular rotation is imparted on the bullet that causes it to rise in the early part of its flight. The over simplified example in the Marine manual is horribly worded and the illustration is even worse leading to this widespread misconception. I’ve got some 25 zeroing targets on my site at http://www.spuler.us/gunsandammo/?p=253 — both for M4 carbine, and M16 style rifles. Where I impact a target is more a matter of your perspective (line of sight) than magic rotational effects. Can I use A 36 yard zero for my 300 blackout as well ? We’re shooting a Remington 700 chambered in .308 and plan to use the 180 grain Remington Core-Lokt mentioned above. I’m using firefox and its slowly becoming the bane of my existence as I’ve got 3 different sizes so far. The Top 15 Most Concealable Semi-Automatic Handguns, Have Gun, Will Travel: Transporting Your Handgun Across the United States. 510 Columbia Ave Unit Box 1011 Then I came across the below YT video from Shawn Ryan who talked about the 36 yard zero. I am sure the Magnus effect is real, but to the discussion of trajectory rise, it is im sure just a small part of the causes of trajectory rise. Thanks Shawn, love your content and am absolutely dying to try this method, my warrant officer buddy sent me your link. Bullet don’t “rise”, they are deliberately lobbed above the line of sight. The bullet never rises above the straight line projected by the bore site. I am old school. In no case, ever, will a bullet rise above the axis of the bore after leaving the muzzle. The Mission of Cheaper Than Dirt! i was able to print using paint and other apps,  =  Get a bunch of gun nuts together and a physics fight breaks out. As the forces of gravity and friction slow the bullet down the anglular forces lessen. It is a poor crutch for a man with a small vocabulary and in most cases, little intelligence.” That was a direct quote from Pamphlet 21-13, Department of the Army September 1964). Since the barrel is only slightly canted, it doesn’t take long (i.e. Mentioning the Magnus Effect in the present discussion about ranges where you are relying on a couple of inches of gravity-induced drop to be close enough to kill a man (or a moose) DRT is just plain silly. Those of us who Remember physics 101 (and in my case, teach Calculus 101, which uses physics problems as examples) remember a formula like h = v_0 t – 1/2 at^2, where v_0 is the initial (upward) velocity, a is the acceleration due to gravity (e.g. it's a great zero for red dots especially for the 200 and in range for what most people are going to be using it for for self defense etc. For practical shooting, a bullet cannot rise above it’s bore-sight line. But to be accurate, you need to shoot at 300 yards to verify your zero. I have every intention of checking. Is there a true measurement for poa vs poi in order to do this so I can just measure and make my own sharpie dot to compensate for the drop while trying to do a 36 yard zero at 25 yards. When your sights are aligned perfectly horizontally, the barrel of your firearm is canted very slightly up, to impart an initial upward velocity. If the rifle is properly zeroed for 300 yards/meters, the trajectory (path of the bullet) will rise approximately 7 1/2 inches above the line of sight at a distance of approximately 175 yards/meters. If this were to be setup precisely with no distractions to the round while carrying the 300 yard length, you would have a hole at the 36 target and 300 target to be fairly fairly close to the exact same elevation while the 150 yard target would be much higher. That includes the military guys, unless you are a trained sniper. Or have angles become curves in this universe of which you speak? Battle Zero for 5.56 55gr 325 yards equals 297 meters or 300 meters. In fact, that 55gr 5.56mm with its muzzle velocity of around 3200ft/s has an initial vertical velocity in the neighborhood of 6.5ft/sec.). Then, cant your rifle 90 degrees to the right or left and shoot another tight group using the exact same point of aim. (Of course, this formula discounts the effects of air resistance, which in our case is not a very bad assumption since the *vertical* velocity of the bullet is so small, while its *horizontal* velocity is quite large. Nvm I get it. You cannot go wrong with either. Even differences such as the scope you have mounted on your particular rifle will change the MPBR and subsequent zero. This conversation is just killing me! A 50 yard zero allows the shooter to use a simple center-mass hold to ranges of point blank to 200-250 yards, depending on rifle and ammunition combination. please disregard request; used IE browser instead of Firefox, and image saved as a .PNG file. at least this is my understanding, its been about 12 years since ive taken a physics course. The 50 yard zero provides for effective center-mass hits on target at the ranges where a carbine is most commonly used. If the bullet never rose, it would never hit the point of aim. Read the part about the Magnus effect. All based off line of sight height above bore of the barrel. For the moron who stated that bullets don’t rise, just put your science to the test by vising in a rifle zeroed at 300 yards on a target 24″ high and the straddle the line of sight at 100 yards. Then go set up some new targets at 36, 150, and 300 yards all in line with their dead center bulls eyes being at the exact same elevation, including the tip of your barrel after being mounted in a vice and aimed for the 36 yard target (now this is for the M16). 9.8m/s^2, or 32ft/s^2) and t is the time since launch. You guys must have slept throught physics 101. yes, both gravity and friction act on a bullet and will cause it to fall, which is why a bullet drops. The illustration above demonstrates how a battlesight zero works. thanks Find the manufacturers information on your favorite rifle load, google up a ballistics calculator, and in just a few minutes after plugging in your data you’ll have a good MPBR zero for your setup. Now we have a military where Affirmative Action Figures are more cherished than warriors as the Ultimate AAF has converted the military more into a Camouflage Welfare System and Social Experiment than even the Clintons. Thanks! It first crosses the line of sight on its upward path of trajectory at 36 yards, and again farther down range at 300 yards. I printed off one of your 36 yard targets. Even though you feel as if the rifle is level, it in fact is not. −  Please click the reload button and complete the captcha once again. Standard ballistic table provide that information. Like a ball, it is this angle, not angular momentum, which causes it to rise. If you take a look at the target you will see thick gray vertical and horizontal lines that intersect at a black circle.  This is going to be where your point of aim is.  Center your red dot here.  If you look below that you will see thick black vertical and horizontal lines that intersect at another small yellow dot on the 0:0 axis point surrounded by a yellow faded dot.  This is going to be where you want your bullet impacts to be.  With this being said, your impacts will not hit where you are aiming.  The bottom dot on the 0:0 axis is where the bullet would hit if you were aiming at a target 25 yards away with a 36yd zero which is approximately -.72″ below your point of aim.  The bullet is still rising to meet your point of aim at 36 yards, this is why the impact point is low on the target.  The faded yellow circle around the black circle is there for variables such as sight to bore distance and bullet weight.  I use .77 grain for a truer flight, more accuracy, and more knockdown power. 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